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PCGS Error On Slabs from WTC

So I think I have talked about the error's that PCGS made on some of the slabs that has the WTC coins in them, just got another examplet that comes from Bobby he has two coins both in the 1 of 1ooo series. As you can see on these pages the 1 of 1000 series should be a 1 oz silver coin MS69 from 2001 and a 1999 1/4 gold eagle also MS69. Well Bobby is sending me a picture of 2 coins both WTC 2001 1 oz silver coin but have a look at the flag insert on the coins.

wtc 1 of 1000

Both coins have the 1 of 1000 on them but one is MS69 the other is Gem Uncirculated. I wonder if more coins like this is out there. As always please send me pictures of coins that are special in some way or not posted on these pages as I want all the WTC coins to be up here at some point. I am not sure what to think about this coin, as with other coins we have seen from the WTC coin collection it did look like PCGS was ina bit of a rush when grading the coins. As Bobby points out the coin graded Gem Uncirculated is from Collectors Universe as can be seen on the back of the coin and we know that Collectors Universe parent company to PCGS did all the early grading and only certifed coins as have come from the WTC vault but never grade anything with MS eventhough some of the Gem coins they certified looks good enough to be MS material. So that could be a possible explaination that this coin was a coin that got graded right before PCGS took over. Another possible senario could be that some coins graded in the 1 of 1000 series was all graded at first by collectors universe and was later send back for MS grading at PCGS this one for some reason did not make it back. This could be confirm if all other coins in the series all where grade by PCGS ( look at the back)

Many other possible reasons but that is what I could comeĀ  up with from what I know about the coins.

Here is the back image of the two coins.

wtc-back

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Comments on “PCGS Error On Slabs from WTC”

Ross said:

Hi Jacob,

Was looking over your site and discovered another case where cert verification can give us a more detailed picture about populations.

Since you were good enough to show a picture of the BACK of one of the MS69 1 of 1000 silver Eagle coins, I had a seed number to revisit PCGS’s cert verification site and “dig”. Turns out there are exactly 500 identical $1 Silver eagles (consecutive Cert #’s 71239453 to 71239952) which your coin picture number 71239886 falls within. Since it’s identified as a “1 of 1000” coin, I would presume half were slabbed as “Collector’s Univers/Gem Uncirculated” and the other half were slabbed as “PCGS with Verification Numbers”. Maybe the owner of the coins requested this. Could it be that PCGS charged less for CU/GU slabbing than they did for Number grading? If so, mightened the owner say, just slab half with grading and half without, possibly to save money? I think it’s interesting that exactly half got graded as a bulk submission, don’t you?

Anyone who thinks PCGS doesn’t have detailed records of this stuff is crazy, because look at what we can find through the “back door”!

Ross

Ross said:

Well, I’ll be the first to admit this gets more baffling by the minute. I found another MS69 Silver eagle from the 1 of 1000 series with a PCGS number outside the previously mentioned 500 coin “cert range” (71239453-71239952). This one is # 71232364, and as it turns out falls within ANOTHER 500 coin range (71231974-71232473)! All of these 1000 coins are 2001 MS69 $1 silver eagles. I have found examples from each range slabbed as 1 of 1000 WTC coins.

Dilemma: There appear to be 1000 (discrete cert number) MS69 coins labeled as 1 of 1000, yet there are also Collector’s Universe/Gem Uncirculated 2001 Silver Eagles slabbed as 1 of 1000 coins. Conclusion? Could there be TWO separate 1 of 1000 sets?!! (one with PCGS MS69 slabbed coins and one with Collectors Universe/Gem Uncirculated slabbed coins?)

:)

Ross said:

One further comment. I see definite evidence that there are 1000 “1 of 1000” PCGS sets, each consisting of a 2001 MS69 $1 Silver Eagle and a 1999 MS69 $5 Gold eagle. There are two separate consecutive 1000 certificate # runs (bulk submissions?) that support this as follows:

Qty 500 2001 MS69 $1 Silver Eagles
Cert #’s: 71231974-71232473
Qty 500 1999 MS69 $5 Gold Eagles
Cert #’s: 71232474-71232973

AND

Qty 500 2001 MS69 $1 Silver Eagles
Cert #’s: 71239453-71239952
Qty 500 2001 MS69 $1 Gold Eagles
Cert #’s: 71239953-71240452

There are also in existence as indicated from the photo above additional “Collectors Universe/Gem Uncirculated” $1 Siver Eagles, marked “1 of 1000” on the flag label. Has anyone found examples of $5 Gold Eagles in CU/GU slabs marked “1 of 1000”? At this point I’m guessing not.

I think the “1 of 1000” CU/GU $1 Silver Eagles are an additional “1 of 1000” single coin ‘set’.

Please post a reply if you have info to shed more light on this.

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